SUBJECTS: Political career
ANDREW CLENNELL, HOST: Now we have another retiree here after serving in the Parliament for 17 years, including, of course, famously, as Labor leader. NDIS Minister Bill Shorten is bowing out of politics. Here's a very rapid fire look back at his career, including some of the funnier recent moments with us at Sky.
[Highlights reel]
CLENNELL: Well, joining the panel now is the outgoing NDIS and Government Services Minister, Bill Shorten. He's going to be VC at the University of Canberra. Congratulations on that job.
BILL SHORTEN, MINISTER FOR THE NDIS AND GOVERNMENT SERVICES: Thank you.
CLENNELL: What do you think you'll be remembered most for? Beaconsfield, knifing Kevin Rudd, losing the 2019 election, or the NDIS?
SHORTEN: All of the above? Nothing? I'm very pleased with the – helping the NDIS be created. Yes I helped create the NDIS, then I worked hard to get Labor elected twice and in that sort of cosmic sense of humour that the universe has, I ended up having to come back and help fix up the NDIS so, anyway, but we'll let history judge that I'm not going to be the curator of my own museum. I'm looking forward to my next challenge, which is helping young people, helping the University of Canberra and helping adults who want to do lifelong learning.
CLENNELL: That Rudd thing, it was a kind of a situation where a lot of his colleagues thought, this guy's losing it a bit, you know, but the public didn't see it and that's why, I guess it caused you a bit of grief in the long run? Even though you might not have been the main architect, you were involved, you were seen on the phone outside the restaurant, et cetera. Do you sort of regret some of that? Do you think it was the right leadership change now, reflecting back on it? Do you think you would have got a worse result at that election if you'd stuck with him?
SHORTEN: Well, let's lift the lid on some of that famous footage. When I was outside the restaurant that night, I was doing a parent teacher interview at the local school. It was a rookie mistake to be at the front of the restaurant. All hell is breaking loose and then we had the two phone incident. That was one of – a phone had died and I borrowed Kate Ellis’ phone to just get my messages, but from these images, a whole legend has been written. I think in the Westminster system, parliamentary parties choose their leaders. I think in hindsight that the instability that that caused and the changing of leaders probably did hurt the brand of Labor, but also people's confidence in the system. Having said that, there's been – when I was Opposition Leader, I think Malcolm rolled Tony, then Peter was going to roll Malcolm, but then somehow Scott came out of nowhere and rolled both of them, so, you know, I don't think politics is necessarily going to change from people wanting to have the best chance at elections.
CLENNELL: And the 2019 election loss is there – what do you think could have got you there? What policies could you have dropped or what moments do you think led to you not achieving that? And how does it feel? Because for so long, people who know, you know, that you wanted that job of Prime Minister, you wanted the opportunity to lead the nation. Do you have comfort now that you – are you able to accept it, that you didn't get there?
SHORTEN: Oh, I accepted it on the night. Yeah, listen, the universe doesn't grant reruns. We made mistakes. I made some mistakes. There are some external factors, but it happened. We then had the three years of the Morrison Government and then, as I said in my valedictory speech to the Parliament, Prime Minister Albanese was able to be elected and a lot of the work we'd done between 2013 and 2019, I think laid the groundwork for 2022. But that's our democratic system and, you know, you can learn as much from failure as you can from victory. And personally, two lessons for me, one was that good people can actually disagree, and I think that going forward in the national interest, somehow we've got to have our political debates where we disagree. But don't assume that because the man or woman in the street doesn't agree with you, that doesn't make them wrong or bad people. So, I've learned a bit of the, you know, people do look at the same set of facts and draw different conclusions and we've got to just live with that.
OLIVIA CAISLEY, HOST: The NDIS is such a big part of your legacy and speaking with people in the disability sector, there's a genuine sadness that they're losing such a champion in you. Who would you like to see take up that mantle and keep fighting for the sector?
SHORTEN: Well, the Prime Minister will pick from a very talented frontbench, someone to do the NDIS role and the government services role. But what I've also been saying to people with disability and their advocates is don't rely on particular special politicians just to sort of swing in through the jungle vines and sort things out. I want to encourage people with disability, the employers in the sector, the unions, everyone, to work together so that you can almost politician proof the future of the NDIS. We are making it sustainable, we're still keeping its integrity, but what we've got to do is quite genuinely a project as exceptional and big as that. Clean it up, make it true to purpose and don't rely on politicians. Just make sure it can sort of run almost despite the political system.
CAISLEY: Have you put any names forward, though, to the Prime Minister? Any suggestions?
SHORTEN: It'll be up to the PM and I wouldn't want to blight anyone's chances by nominating them.
TRUDY MCINTOSH, HOST: Would you be able to give us some frank and fearless advice, just with the cameras watching? What's your free advice to Anthony Albanese, ahead of the election?
SHORTEN: Back yourself. Life's not a dress rehearsal. If you really think something's worth doing, back yourself.
CAMERON REDDIN, HOST: Can I ask about your seat going forward, too? Maribyrnong. The Greens are really cock-a-hoop, for lack of a better word, that you're retiring. They think that the lack of your presence in that part of Melbourne will help their cause in a number of seats. What does Labor need to do to hold the Greens off in areas like that?
SHORTEN: Work hard locally. The reality is, I do know a lot of my voters. I've been at their school fetes. I shop in the local shops. Hard work locally. You can't just rely on sending out a couple of letters and the national TV campaign. Hard work, hard work, hard work. People want to vote for people they know.
CAISLEY: Why have Labor then picked a candidate who isn't from your local area? From Queensland?
SHORTEN: Well, she lives down the road. She moved from Queensland about four years ago. Four or five years ago. The reality is that she'll work hard. At the end of the day, the only vote you're guaranteed not to get is the one you don't ask for. So, just knock on the doors, make the calls, make the personal connection. In a world where people are disillusioned with politics, they want authentic, they want to see, touch and feel who's in front of them, who's asking for their vote.
CLENNELL: Climate change is an issue which you cared passionately about. It was something you obviously prosecuted in that 2019 election and yet we still see it, with the blackouts in NSW, with Peter Dutton saying we should go in a nuclear direction, with electricity bills going up very much front and centre. What's the future for this debate in Australia, do you think?
SHORTEN: I'd sort of hoped it was settled after 2022, but clearly it's being re argued. I think 80% of the voters think it's real and what we've got to do is just explain to people how we secure their energy. I mean, we are the only country in the world who's gifted an entire continent to be in charge of. We do have the wind, we do have the solar, but we're also going to need to use some fossil fuels like we should stop arguing about and just like back our own self interest. We've got all of the above.
REDDIN: We did show some of your greatest hits a little bit earlier, one that wasn't in there, but that has always stayed with me and I've always wanted to ask you this. One of the moments, I think it was the 2016 campaign with a shopper in an aisle where you asked them what their favourite type of lettuce was. I want to know, Bill Shorten, what is your favourite type of lettuce?
SHORTEN: That was when, it was in January of 2016, I think, as usual, everyone had written me off, but I think Malcolm had had one of his trademark thought bubbles, which then materialised to nothing by lunchtime. But anyway, for two weeks we were going to draw attention, they wanted to increase the GST and so I got an exchange about lettuce. I think journalists were surprised that I back dark coloured lettuce, dark green over light green because it's got, I think, more, you know, better health properties for you. So, I like darker leafed lettuce.
REDDIN: So not a fan of the iceberg, in other words?
SHORTEN: Listen, iceberg will do the job, but –
CLENNELL: All the big issues here. Look, can I just ask you finally, who do you reckon is your favourite colleague in the Parliament that you've served with? Favourite colleague or two?
SHORTEN: There's quite a few, so I hate taking things on notice, but there are quite a few. I've got a lot of respect for a lot of my colleagues. Some cameos without saying who my favourite is, Mike Freelander, the doctor from Southwestern Sydney. Delivered half the kids or he's been their paediatrician. He is as honest as the day is long. On the other side, I think Darren Chester, gee he works that Gippsland area hard. I got lots of – listen a lot of those MPs do work hard behind the scenes. Us frontbenchers get a bit more of the coverage, but there's some amazing – Anne Stanley, you know, grew up in the seat where she lives. She works really hard there, like, there's actually quite a lot of really decent people. There's a few scallywags, but better to name the people you like than the people you don't.
CLENNELL: Bill Shorten, thanks so much and all the best for your future.
SHORTEN: Super. Thank you.
